Law does not dictate morality for conscientious people like BJ and Alex. Only tools allow their morality to be dictated by their slavemasters in Washington. You were given a brain, please don't be afraid to use it.

These activists are crinimals when they break into a place and free animals their not heros their crinimals their stupid actions could lead to disasterous for the bird life and the animals will most likly starve they should get jail and fined

I tend to support these activists. If you believe in something so strongly you should stand up for your beliefs. Besides fur farms are an abominable institution that should be outlawed.

Why do radical activists think they are above the law? If Viehl and Hall had any integrity, they would plead guilty and release a statement about why they committed these criminal acts.

I wish that people who work at fur farms would be killed in a horrible way and skinned. Seriously.

I am astounded at above commenters such as "Joe" and "Tom" who seem to equate legality with morality. Tom speaks about the action of freeing animals inherently causing fear-- but can we truly start convicting people on the byproducts of there actions? And the fact is-- causing pain is simply a necesssary evil when it comes to survivalism, however, because we have moved beyond fur as a necessity in our society, the pain inflicted can only be labeled as "evil", because it is not necessary. Financial ruin bears no sympathy from me when it is based off an exploitive industry. The constant question of equating animal life to human life is unnecessary in many of these circumstances because it is simply a question of equating suffering. The bias of species-based preference is inherent, even if not correct, but no one can deny that those mink can suffer, similarly to a human. Therefore, there suffering can only be regarded in the way we regard human suffering-- because what is being felt is the same. Animals are different than humans, but by classifying them via their differences in a hope to neglect their similarities, humans propagate the most vivid platforms of biased philosophies such a sexism and racism. We may regard there comprehension in relation to ours and treat them differently in that respect because in that respect they are different-- when it comes to suffering, it's all the same. These men if guilty, are only guilty in the eyes of greed and oppression, and to be favored in those eyes is no proud fact at all.

Compare ALF/ELF to the right-wing domestic terrorists who MURDERED federal judges in the name of racism (or the handful of anti-abortion murderers, who the FBI also considers terrorists...but somehow, not AS BAD terrorists as ALF/ELF). As you pointed out, the FBI admits ALF/ELF never killed anyone.

The astounding part is that ALF could be called the NUMBER ONE domestic terror threat by the FBI, when they've murdered no one (and so disorganized that it's more of a 'movement' than any coherent group), at the same time that the RIGHT-WING domestic terrorists who've infiltrated the US Army (see below), not only murdered, are somehow considered less of a threat. I'll make an educated guess that the 2 most-likely situations are:

1. the FBI's assessment of DOMESTIC terrorists is as boneheaded as the FBI losing a few thousand laptops per year with classified info and their (non) prevention and (poor) reaction before and after 911 with FOREIGN terrorists (S.N.A.F.U.);
or else...
2. given that the US Army was investigated on how much racist groups are infiltrating their ranks (not IF they are, that was established long ago, but rather HOW MUCH):

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/arti...
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/murders...
. . . perhaps the FBI --instead of the Army-- needs an _independent_ assessment of how many neo-Nazi gangsters collect an FBI paycheck and put on a pointy hood the same night after being paid with taxpayer dollars to work all day (and help their neo-Nazi friends as they work, by mis-allocating the FBI's resources, by pretending that ALF/ELF are more of a threat than neo-Nazi groups). The US Army and FBI said racists are diverting Army weapons into the hands of racist groups in news articles like the above...and that it wasn't a few scattered individuals, but often a coordinated effort, and the same absolutely can happen in the FBI instead of the Army. ...I wonder if non-white racists like the BPP or Farrakhan's thugs are doing the same as the neo-Nazis, but haven't seen it investigated (of course, now that the POTUS is part black, I'd expect a crackdown on Nazis...but hope we don't swing into a "look the other way" attitude to favor the _opposite_ racist thugs).

What else could have caused Bush's FBI to consider the more murderous and more organized domestic groups as LESS of a threat than the ALF/ELF, besides those two options? Is ALF trying to obtain WMD's whereas the neo-Nazis are not? (snort, chortle, we'll find the WMD's that Iraq had before we find the ALF's WMDs!) Whether by accident (SNAFU) --or purposeful corruption-- neither is acceptable.

It'S sad that people don't care ,that these fur workers are killing and abusing animals in such a horriable fashion.The gov. see's nothing wrong with all this abuse,but if a person fails to take their pet to a dr.in a timely matter,they are considered cruel and unfit to keep the pet.The people were there to help the animals,since you all don't care.The fur farm are mean and I wish they would get a taste of their own medicine and live to talk about it.I don't think it is right to hurt others,but I don't think hurting animals in a real bad way all around is right either.Fur is not needed to live and stay warm.You want to wear fur,go to a research lab, maybe they can help you grow your own.
Darla

Since my lifestyle is the exercise of basic Humanity (an ugly word since it places Humans as the pinnacle of creation) then yes I would like to see anything contrary to that be made untenable. As for being a small group I am part of the oneness of all creation, so I am a small group of one which encompasses infinity.

I would save my Mother because I have an actual emotional attachment to her. Any given mink I don't. However, that doesn't mean that I don't respect the mink as it's own creature, with it's own interest in living it's own life as it sees fit.

Hypothetical situations aside, the point wasn't, do you consider a mink equal to your mother so that in a life or death situation, who would you choose. The point was this, if you're in any type of relationship of inequality, you run a greater risk of being abusive to the lesser because you consider them to be inferior. Case in point, Nazis to Jews, Humans to Animals, etc.

Chris, I do consider my mother equal to myself, I do not consider a mink equal to her. I beleive you feel the same, if your mother and a mink were in a burning building and you could only save 1 who would you choose?

Stephen,
I am not missing the point, you however are avoiding one though. You cannot admit that you are part of a small group of people who are trying to force their lifestyle upon others any way they can including the use of terrorism.

Do you have to practice missing the point, or is it a natural talent.

The point is that just because something is legal does not make it right. Slavery in the US, Apartheid in South Africa, all legal in their time, now relics of a barbarous age. And before you say it; it was said of people of colour, "but they're only animals, not humans"

Comparing Jew's suffering in concentrations camps to a Mink in a fur farm is obscene?

It's not as if the Nazi's were skinning Jews to use as lampshades or some other ridiculously arbitrary function.

The same underlying psychology is present in both situations. There is a relationship of inequality. The Nazi's considered the Jews inferior, this culture considers animals to be inferior, in this case mink. This relationship of inequality is a necessary condition for carrying out atrocities. You wouldn't skin your mother alive to wear as an overpriced coat, I would hope you consider your mother on the same equal terms as you do, yourself.

It doesn't stop with the holocaust and animals. Other race relations, dealing with Africans in the slave trades, gender relations, this culture's relation with the natural world, we consider our superficial constructed reality to be superior than the natural world, employer/employee relationships.

When we don't view something as anything other than equal to ourselves, we can perpetrate any type of horrors onto it. By reducing the subject to an object, the door is open.

We are not talking about Jews, to compare a mink farm with Nazi concentration camps is obscene. These 2 are like the Nazi's though, they are a small group of people who are trying to force others to eat,wear and do what they do. Hitler tried that and lost too.

So your argument fails.

The concentration camps in Nazi Germany were legal until the illegal invasion of Allied Forces changed the balance of power, so you argument fails.

No, but I support legal activity against illegal business.

These 2 if found guilty deserve to be in prison. The farm they tried to ruin is a LEGAL business and if they don't like it then they should try to change to law instead.

So Joe, would you support illegal activity against an illegal business?

It's just not logically consistent.

Terrorism is the intentional use of physical violence directed against innocent persons – human and/or nonhuman animals – to advance the religious, ideological, political, or economic purposes of an individual, organization, corporation, or state government. -- Steven Best and Anthony J. Nocella

Source: http://www.criticalanimalstudies.org/JCAS/Journ...

By using this definition of terrorism, we see who the real terrorists are in this case - those who confine and kill innocent beings for profit - the owners of South Jordan "farm."

The liberators, whomever they may be, are freedom fighters.

Arrested Utah Activists not being given vegan food!

.....Today they had an arraignment hearing in which both pleaded "NOT GUILTY".
They are scheduled for a Bail Hearing on Tuesday, as of right now they are both being held on Felony 3 retainers with NO BAIL.

At this time it looks like each could face up to 6 years in prison and $350,000 in fines if found guilty.

Please send them a letter of support during these first very difficult days behind bars.

Please remember to not mention the specifics of their case, or anything that could be used against them in this very precarious pre-trial phase:

William Viehl
Booking #:906617
Prisoner ID: 323754
c/o Salt Lake County Metro Jail
3415 S. 900 W.
Salt Lake City, UT 84119

AND

Alex Jason Hall
Booking number: 906610
Prisoner ID: 323748
c/o Salt Lake County Metro Jail
3415 S. 900 W.
Salt Lake City, UT 84119

*WE JUST FOUND OUT THAT THEY ARE NOT BEING FED ADEQUATE VEGAN FOOD. WE WERE TOLD THAT THEY WERE BEING FED VEGAN FOOD. HOWEVER BJ'S WIFE JUST INFORMED US THAT BJ HAS ONLY HAD LETTUCE AND A SLICE OF AN APPLE SINCE YESTERDAY! THEY LIED TO US! THEY ARE NOT ALLOWING INMATES TO TRADE FOOD EITHER.

Please take a minute to call and and politely DEMAND the two are be given adequate vegan food.

Phone calls to the jail are very effective and have won many prisoners vegan meals:

(801) 743-5000 dial 1 then 0 to get right to an operator.

or

(801) 743-5500

IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEND DONATIONS:
Please visit their support page: www. myspace. com/​​supportbjandale​x (there is a paypal account to which you can donate) or email: bjandalexsuppor​t@​​gmail.​​com

-Animal Defense League of Salt Lake City
www.ADLSLC.org
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2009/03/423728.html

This is ridiculous and dangerous. Is the Obama administration going to do something about the outrage that is branding people terrorists? In fact, why not drop this word altogether, it means nothing anymore.

Tom clearly values money over life. He might not feel the same if it were HIS life being taken for money.

awwww...the poor animal abusers might be faced with "financial ruin." Cry me a river Tom; that's what they said about ending the slave trade. i guess Tom/Joe would have considered John Brown a terrorist as well.

Looks like trial is set for May 11th.

2 plead not guilty in mink release case
March 6th, 2009 @ 11:32am
SALT LAKE CITY (AP) -- Two men indicted in connection with a break-in at a South Jordan mink farm last summer and a similar attempt at another mink operation two months later have pleaded not guilty.

William James Viehl, 22, of Layton, and Alex Jason Hall, 20, of Ogden, entered the pleas on Friday before U.S. Magistrate Judge Brooke Wells.

A trial has been set for May 11.

In August, hundreds of mink were released and breeding records destroyed at the McMullin mink farm. Shortly afterward, the Animal Liberation Front posted a statement from a "local soldier out of Utah" taking credit for the incident.

Each man faces a felony charge of damage and interference with animal enterprises. Each also faces a misdemeanor.

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=5776289

"the American people cannot be forced into anothers belief thru terror. ……"


I highly doubt the intentions of these two had anything to do with forcing anyone else to believe the way they do. It was purely and simply to free those creatures from their confines and from a future as a fur coat.

We will be holding a benefit meeting for those who have been arrested and imprisoned for the cause. We also intend to have a spirited discussion about the AETA and what it means to us. As it will also be a vegan potluck, and having read the post about the FBI trying to infiltrate them, I'm a little curious...

"extremely simplistic definition",, yes, it is,,, in a "nutshell", that's it

"The stated intention of underground actions like this is not to create fear, it’s to save animals." ,, but in doing one, the other is achieved regardless of the intention, as for saving animals, i can respect that, there are so many that need help and so few willing to 'take that chance'. and Will,, your responce to me have thus far been well reasoned and polite, not any of the vindictive that i thought i would get for playing the devil's advocate. thank you.
as for the 2 young men in question,,, we should all be careful,, what will be illegal next year,,,,

Looks like Joe called in sick today and "Tom" came in to take his place.

"real" TERRORISM ??????
Common definitions of terrorism refer only to those acts which are intended to create fear (terror), are perpetrated for an ideological goal.

ummm,,, seems to fit

Tom:
Even going with that extremely simplistic definition, of terrorism as anything that is intended to create fear, this still doesn't fit.

The stated intention of underground actions like this is not to create fear, it's to save animals.

Although I don't agree with threatening or harming even the people who make a living imprisoning, torturing and murdering animals just so we can take things from them that are not ours, Tom, there are PLENTLY of ways to make a livelyhood without harming and taking the lives other innocent beings!

Unfortunately, sometimes people who know what is right and aren't afraid to stand up for it must break a law before any attention is brought to an injustice on our fellow creatures.
It's PAST time we move out of the dark ages! We don't all live up in the Arctic Circle(and even the Eskimos/natives who do only take/kill what they NEED and leave the rest alone) where fur may be necessary as the only protection against bitter cold; there are plenty of materials that are fashionable and just as effective for keeping warm that do NOT involve harming others.

Will
That may be,,, what i see is a family faced with finacial ruin,, did they also have employees that are now uncertain about their own future??? what would these 2 'activist' do next? when thing don't happen to their satisfaction???? the American people cannot be forced into anothers belief thru terror. ......

You're absolutely right. Actions like this have a negative financial impact on the owners of the farm and their employees. However, I have no interest in debating whether or not this is an ethical tactic. And I have never questioned whether actions like this are criminal.

The point you're missing is that just because it is breaking the law doesn't mean it is TERRORISM. Labeling it as such is an insult to those who have died as a result of "real" terrorism, it wastes law enforcement resources, and it prejudices the jury.

Of all the things that I might consider "terror," two 20-something kids trying to save animals from being turned into fur coats isn't one of them.

i have been to the ALF website and BiteBack and a few other,,,, i have read what some of these people did to others,,, threatening e-mails, letters, phone calls,,,, throwing paint on them, have even read where a fire BOMB was thrown on the porch,,, have also read where acid was thrown,, children threatened, property destroyed,,, so yea,,, terrorist is an apt description,, pity the sentence does not reflect the harm done to others,,,

Tom:
Please re-read the article. These activists are not accused of any of the things you listed. They're accused of releasing mink from a fur farm and spraypainting anti-fur messages on the walls.

Here's another article on these indictments.

2 men indicted in break-in at Utah mink farm
http://www.cnbc.com/id/29548104

"We're happy that these individuals have been apprehended," he (FBI) said Thursday afternoon. "We would classify them, of course, as animal terrorists."

"...is that one is intended to destroy life while the other is intended to save it."

Absolutely beautiful, Will. Thanks for posting this. Terrifying. They have to stifle any resistance to any aspect of industrial civilization, fearing that even the smallest acts will breach the dam. So to speak, of course ;)

consider using tor before visiting that final nail link will posted.

but, by all means, it's a site worth visiting.

"...One is intended to destroy life while the other is intended to save it."

Very good point, Mr. Potter.

i had no idea there were freekin mink farms in the us. dang well people are getting brave these days

It looks like there are actually quite a few, according to the pro-ALF website "The Final Nail."
http://www.finalnail.com/fur.htm

I want to clarify something that has fabricated by the media coverage so far. The media is saying that these two activists were arrested based on grand jury testimonies from other activists. This is a fabrication. I think it is being done purposefully to create divisiveness in the community. The media, as usual, never actually verified whether this was true or not -- so they were obviously told so, mistakenly so, by the FBI, I am assuming.