Comments on: Insane Terrorism Drill: Animal Rights Activists With Hostages http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/ "Eco-terrorism," environmental activism and animal rights activism Fri, 10 Feb 2012 18:26:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: BadGirl43 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-230104 BadGirl43 Thu, 22 Oct 2009 16:45:09 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-230104 This is a trick question, right? , This is a trick question, right? ,

]]> By: GW http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-172098 GW Thu, 02 Oct 2008 00:43:30 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-172098 Joe, you moron. Just because something is legal doesn't make it right. Ever hear of slavery? I bet if Joe were alive during the civil war he would have considered John Brown a terrorist. Joe, you moron. Just because something is legal doesn’t make it right. Ever hear of slavery? I bet if Joe were alive during the civil war he would have considered John Brown a terrorist.

]]> By: Will Potter http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170920 Will Potter Mon, 22 Sep 2008 02:43:41 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170920 #23: "If the crime was being pinned on a group that you weren’t ideologically sympathetic towards I doubt you’d be this scrupulous..." Actually, I would. Because scare-mongering and political witch hunts don't solve crimes. The reason I was vocal about this particular scenario, though, is that, as you might have noticed, the entire focus of this website is on how enviro/animal advocates are being labeled terrorists. That's why I made this post: because it's directly related to all other content. Beyond that, if you truly believe it was animal rights activists responsible for the bombing, and you truly believe they may take hostages, how does making this an "animal rights terrorist" drill help prepare for that? What skills are inherent in an "animal rights terrorist" drill that differ from any other hostage situation? #23:
“If the crime was being pinned on a group that you weren’t ideologically sympathetic towards I doubt you’d be this scrupulous…”

Actually, I would. Because scare-mongering and political witch hunts don’t solve crimes. The reason I was vocal about this particular scenario, though, is that, as you might have noticed, the entire focus of this website is on how enviro/animal advocates are being labeled terrorists. That’s why I made this post: because it’s directly related to all other content.

Beyond that, if you truly believe it was animal rights activists responsible for the bombing, and you truly believe they may take hostages, how does making this an “animal rights terrorist” drill help prepare for that? What skills are inherent in an “animal rights terrorist” drill that differ from any other hostage situation?

]]> By: a http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170919 a Mon, 22 Sep 2008 02:32:01 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170919 More to the point, you ask why the government doesn't "choose right wing groups for such drills" but you know exactly why: it's because "The University of California system has been the target of heated animal rights campaigning," not heated campaigning by right wing groups. There's reason to believe that that campaigning has turned violent. Do you want UC Berkeley to wait until the Santa Cruz bombings have been DEFINITIVELY pinned on AR activists before preparing for further violence? I doubt UC Berkeley is going to see animal rights activists taking hostages but I think its even less likely they'll see right wingers doing so. Also the article says that this was one of 25 exercises done that weekend, it's not unlikely one of the others had right wing extremists as the villains. I mean there are some things that make sense in this post, but... More to the point, you ask why the government doesn’t “choose right wing groups for such drills” but you know exactly why: it’s because “The University of California system has been the target of heated animal rights campaigning,” not heated campaigning by right wing groups. There’s reason to believe that that campaigning has turned violent. Do you want UC Berkeley to wait until the Santa Cruz bombings have been DEFINITIVELY pinned on AR activists before preparing for further violence? I doubt UC Berkeley is going to see animal rights activists taking hostages but I think its even less likely they’ll see right wingers doing so. Also the article says that this was one of 25 exercises done that weekend, it’s not unlikely one of the others had right wing extremists as the villains. I mean there are some things that make sense in this post, but…

]]> By: a http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170917 a Mon, 22 Sep 2008 02:15:58 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170917 Will Potter you're answering the argument you want to hear rather than the one I'm actually making. Somebody upthread said this: <i>Will, why does this article assume that the bombing of a yeast researcher’s stuff was part of the “heated animal rights campaigning” ?</i> The pamphlet shows that the local AR activists thought they were animal researchers and thus could have targeted them, it's irrelevant that one of them actually wasn't. It would be more responsible of the FBI to keep quiet until they had a suspect, but let's be real, it was probably AR activists, even if other crimes have been misattributed to them in the past. All the meager evidence there is points to them. Again, if the crime was being pinned on a group that you weren't ideologically sympathetic towards I doubt you'd be this scrupulous. Will Potter you’re answering the argument you want to hear rather than the one I’m actually making. Somebody upthread said this:

Will, why does this article assume that the bombing of a yeast researcher’s stuff was part of the “heated animal rights campaigning” ?

The pamphlet shows that the local AR activists thought they were animal researchers and thus could have targeted them, it’s irrelevant that one of them actually wasn’t.

It would be more responsible of the FBI to keep quiet until they had a suspect, but let’s be real, it was probably AR activists, even if other crimes have been misattributed to them in the past. All the meager evidence there is points to them. Again, if the crime was being pinned on a group that you weren’t ideologically sympathetic towards I doubt you’d be this scrupulous.

]]> By: Will Potter http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170911 Will Potter Mon, 22 Sep 2008 00:17:31 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170911 And if they really wanted to make this drill accurate, they could have at least put some of the hostage takers in PETA's chicken costumes and lettuce bikinis. It would have made a better photo, too. And if they really wanted to make this drill accurate, they could have at least put some of the hostage takers in PETA’s chicken costumes and lettuce bikinis. It would have made a better photo, too.

]]> By: Jeremy Beckham http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170908 Jeremy Beckham Mon, 22 Sep 2008 00:07:37 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170908 I want to know specifically how the drill changes at all because it's an "animal rights" takeover anyway. Why do they need to inject that into this to begin with? Do they now negotiate by enticing them with Boca burgers and seitan? Is there a different playbook for vegan hostage-takers? Why don't they just say police trained for a (generic) terrorist hostage situation? Clearly the UC system thought they could achieve a political objective by describing it as such. What if their hostage scenario read: "Police train for situation where black men take white women hostage"? I want to know specifically how the drill changes at all because it’s an “animal rights” takeover anyway. Why do they need to inject that into this to begin with? Do they now negotiate by enticing them with Boca burgers and seitan? Is there a different playbook for vegan hostage-takers? Why don’t they just say police trained for a (generic) terrorist hostage situation?

Clearly the UC system thought they could achieve a political objective by describing it as such.

What if their hostage scenario read: “Police train for situation where black men take white women hostage”?

]]> By: Will Potter http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170876 Will Potter Sun, 21 Sep 2008 12:54:20 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170876 "A": A pamphlet? Really? Is finding a pamphlet in a coffee shop, with addresses of researchers, now enough to attribute a bombing to them before there's any actual proof? A pamphlet like that is also used for home protests, which may be controversial, but are also legal. I've seen similar pamphlets here in DC, and around the country. Give me a break. It IS reckless because we've seen in many instances now that the FBI rushes to label something as "terrorism" and then it's disproven. For instance, the home arsons out in MD, the bomb scare at the UC system, the arson of a pet store in arson, and more. This word is simply too powerful to toss around like that. Once it enters the media in a case, it takes on a life of its own. “A”:

A pamphlet? Really? Is finding a pamphlet in a coffee shop, with addresses of researchers, now enough to attribute a bombing to them before there’s any actual proof? A pamphlet like that is also used for home protests, which may be controversial, but are also legal. I’ve seen similar pamphlets here in DC, and around the country. Give me a break.

It IS reckless because we’ve seen in many instances now that the FBI rushes to label something as “terrorism” and then it’s disproven. For instance, the home arsons out in MD, the bomb scare at the UC system, the arson of a pet store in arson, and more.

This word is simply too powerful to toss around like that. Once it enters the media in a case, it takes on a life of its own.

]]> By: a http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170836 a Sun, 21 Sep 2008 04:41:50 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170836 http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/08/04/MNMI124HSI.DTL The idea that it's "reckless" to attribute the Santa Cruz bombings to animal rights activists is really wishful thinking. Even if the researchers were only working on yeast, one of them had his name and address listed on an AR pamphlet, so obviously the local AR activists thought they were animal researchers. Ecoterrorists <a href="http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/summary/292/5522/1622?ck=nck" rel="nofollow">have been known to make mistakes</a>. If an abortion clinic that had been targeted by pro-life activists was bombed you wouldn't think it was reckless to blame it on pro-life terrorists. http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/08/04/MNMI124HSI.DTL

The idea that it’s “reckless” to attribute the Santa Cruz bombings to animal rights activists is really wishful thinking. Even if the researchers were only working on yeast, one of them had his name and address listed on an AR pamphlet, so obviously the local AR activists thought they were animal researchers. Ecoterrorists have been known to make mistakes. If an abortion clinic that had been targeted by pro-life activists was bombed you wouldn’t think it was reckless to blame it on pro-life terrorists.

]]> By: Joe http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/terrorism-drill-animal-rights-activists-with-hostages/647/#comment-170819 Joe Sun, 21 Sep 2008 02:08:35 +0000 http://www.greenisthenewred.com/blog/?p=647#comment-170819 GW, I live in the real world...its you that must live in BIZZARO world if you feel that terrorist tactics are just against LEGAL practices. GW, I live in the real world…its you that must live in BIZZARO world if you feel that terrorist tactics are just against LEGAL practices.

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